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Does prince really think GOD>MAN>WOMEN>ANIMAL? Over at the housequake they were discussing that prince thought women are below men and males are superior.
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Interesting, but isn't that a societal/global problem?. why point the finger at Prince and JWs? I know people who are not religious who believe that, somehow they were raised to have that attitude. | |
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what? come on...Prince thinking something like this? eye highly doubt it as he seems to be one that really honors and appreciates women. ~dueno de nada~ | |
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raddahone said: what? come on...Prince thinking something like this? eye highly doubt it as he seems to be one that really honors and appreciates women.
Didn't he refer to women as "your highness" (sp?) in one of the acoustic songs during Musicology? I think the song was Real Players? And I also believe during the interview on the View back in 98 he spoke about not referring to women as objects or something like that. | |
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i think a lot of people confuse concepts of dominion with domination. whether we agree or disagree, i think the concept is that god is meant to be the caretaker of all living things, man is meant to be the caretaker of woman, and man and woman are equal caretakers of animals and the environment. it doesn't mean one is "lesser" or more or less important - it means one has a role of guardianship over another.
peanut butter, there's no doubt  | |
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raddahone said: what? come on...Prince thinking something like this? eye highly doubt it as he seems to be one that really honors and appreciates women.
I agree totally!  | |
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Anx said: i think a lot of people confuse concepts of dominion with domination. whether we agree or disagree, i think the concept is that god is meant to be the caretaker of all living things, man is meant to be the caretaker of woman, and man and woman are equal caretakers of animals and the environment. it doesn't mean one is "lesser" or more or less important - it means one has a role of guardianship over another.
again, i'm not saying this is what *I* believe - it's just an interpretation. very well said | |
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Anx said: i think a lot of people confuse concepts of dominion with domination. whether we agree or disagree, i think the concept is that god is meant to be the caretaker of all living things, man is meant to be the caretaker of woman, and man and woman are equal caretakers of animals and the environment. it doesn't mean one is "lesser" or more or less important - it means one has a role of guardianship over another.
I think that's simply the justification people with this ideology might express to those with opposing ideologies. In other words: A nice way of putting it. | |
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raddahone said: what? come on...Prince thinking something like this? eye highly doubt it as he seems to be one that really honors and appreciates women.
On the DVD where the director Kevin Smith talks of his experiences at Paisley Park during the last Celebration, he paraphrased Prince as having said that during one of the discussions with fans. So it depends on whether you believe Kevin remembered word for word or was merely giving an indication of the type of religious things Prince was saying. Even then it is no doubt out of context with the things Prince was saying around it. I think a lot of religions technically believe this, since from their point of view Man was created first, then Woman was created as a companion, and the animals were created to serve them. I think Prince could believe this in its theoretical sense, but the question really is does Prince force women into a subserviant role? In which case I've always felt he treated women as fairly as anyone else, in other words sometimes he's good to them and sometimes he's bad to them. | |
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NouveauDance said: Anx said: i think a lot of people confuse concepts of dominion with domination. whether we agree or disagree, i think the concept is that god is meant to be the caretaker of all living things, man is meant to be the caretaker of woman, and man and woman are equal caretakers of animals and the environment. it doesn't mean one is "lesser" or more or less important - it means one has a role of guardianship over another.
I think that's simply the justification people with this ideology might express to those with opposing ideologies. In other words: A nice way of putting it. actually, i think it's the other way around. this was the intended meaning, but people twisted it into something that served their particular power issues. of course, it's more complimentary to a theist-phobic worldview to think that god wanted to put the smackdown on women and animals from the get-go, so i guess people will believe what fits their baggage. peanut butter, there's no doubt | |
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Anx said: i think a lot of people confuse concepts of dominion with domination. whether we agree or disagree, i think the concept is that god is meant to be the caretaker of all living things, man is meant to be the caretaker of woman, and man and woman are equal caretakers of animals and the environment. it doesn't mean one is "lesser" or more or less important - it means one has a role of guardianship over another.
again, i'm not saying this is what *I* believe - it's just an interpretation. Well put -- I agree. This is what the Bible says... Jesus alone is to be the head of all (no other man, no church, no one!), and in a physical relationship between a man and wife, the man is to be the head of the woman (or else her father if she is not married). What does that mean?? The Bible tells us that the man is to be to the woman as Christ is to the church. Well you know what... Christ laid His life down for the church! He took a beating for the church when he didn't deserve one ounce of it. He did it ALL for us -- He sacrificed His life for us. So... if people want to think that being the "head" over a woman means domination, they are completely wrong. It means laying down your life for your wife and loving her like no other could ever do! Peace. | |
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Moving JW topic over to politics and religion Edmonton, AB -  - "all seeing, all knowing-thats our luv -prb"-"Yeah...we're like the Hotel California of fansites" - Nikademus - Nothinbutjoy¤°: I am so beyond mother fucking glad that it's the God Damned weekend that i could just shit kitttens |
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theocratic order .. | |
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SpisaRibb said: theocratic order
what does that mean? | |
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mikek1 said: SpisaRibb said: theocratic order
what does that mean? it's a term from the Jehovah's Witnesses doctrine and was used in the lyrics for prince's album 'the rainbow children' it means god>man>woman, and prince did advocate it as the correct way to be.   | |
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XxAxX said: mikek1 said: what does that mean? it's a term from the Jehovah's Witnesses doctrine and was used in the lyrics for prince's album 'the rainbow children' it means god>man>woman, and prince did advocate it as the correct way to be. I don't think it does mean that. I think it means 'God's rule', god ruling over everything else. 1+1+1 = 3 can mean God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit. | |
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metalorange said: XxAxX said: it's a term from the Jehovah's Witnesses doctrine and was used in the lyrics for prince's album 'the rainbow children' it means god>man>woman, and prince did advocate it as the correct way to be. I don't think it does mean that. I think it means 'God's rule', god ruling over everything else. 1+1+1 = 3 can mean God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit. uh.... no. theocratic order is that god, man, woman, child .. | |
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SpisaRibb said: metalorange said: I don't think it does mean that. I think it means 'God's rule', god ruling over everything else. 1+1+1 = 3 can mean God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit. uh.... no. theocratic order is that god, man, woman, child From http://dictionary.referen...theocratic the definition of Theocratic: 1. a form of government in which God or a deity is recognized as the supreme civil ruler, the God's or deity's laws being interpreted by the ecclesiastical authorities. 2. a system of government by priests claiming a divine commission. 3. a commonwealth or state under such a form or system of government. Doesn't say anything about man, woman, child. | |
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metalorange said: SpisaRibb said: uh.... no. theocratic order is that god, man, woman, child From http://dictionary.referen...theocratic the definition of Theocratic: 1. a form of government in which God or a deity is recognized as the supreme civil ruler, the God's or deity's laws being interpreted by the ecclesiastical authorities. 2. a system of government by priests claiming a divine commission. 3. a commonwealth or state under such a form or system of government. Doesn't say anything about man, woman, child. yeah you left out the relationship between each in your definition .. | |
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SpisaRibb said: metalorange said: From http://dictionary.referen...theocratic the definition of Theocratic: 1. a form of government in which God or a deity is recognized as the supreme civil ruler, the God's or deity's laws being interpreted by the ecclesiastical authorities. 2. a system of government by priests claiming a divine commission. 3. a commonwealth or state under such a form or system of government. Doesn't say anything about man, woman, child. yeah you left out the relationship between each in your definition I don't understand what you mean. It's not MY definition of 'theocratic' it is www.dictionary.com's definition. They are saying a theocratic order is a system where God is seen as the ultimate authority, the definition does not go onto include 'the relationship' so I did not leave it out, I'm just saying the definition does not include anything about it being a hierarchy. Of course if you can supply a link on the web that alters a different definition... | |
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mikek1 said: SpisaRibb said: theocratic order
what does that mean? Here's how the Bible defines it: But I want you to know that the head of every man is the Christ; in turn the head of a woman is the man; in turn the head of the Christ is God. (1 Corinthians 11:3)
Animals aren't mentioned specifically here, but in Genesis, God gave the command to the man and the woman to care for the animals. Jehovah's Witnesses refer to this as "theocratic order" because the principle was laid out in God's inspired word rather than as a concept created by humans. | |
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"Shake yer reptile, baby!"  | |
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my brother is a jw, and when he got married, the brother who officiated said "god created woman as an accessory to man", which not only annoyed me, it also cracked me up because it made me have a toy commercial flashback in my head where man was an action figure, and at the end of the commercial it would be like "woman sold seperately"
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cborgman said: my brother is a jw, and when he got married, the brother who officiated said "god created woman as an accessory to man", which not only annoyed me, it also cracked me up because it made me have a toy commercial flashback in my head where man was an action figure, and at the end of the commercial it would be like "woman sold seperately"
he also made sure to include "god intended marriage to be between a man and a woman" and then looked right at my mother and i (both gay) sitting in the front row. my mother hissed "just keep smiling" through her teeth at me as she smiled away.  I love you, Chris.  Measure in Love 
"May the voice of the child in you never stop speaking. May it fall like a gift from heaven, offering to dessicated words its splendorous burst of laugher, the salt of its tears, its all powerful wildness." Maurice Blanchot | |
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applekisses said: cborgman said: my brother is a jw, and when he got married, the brother who officiated said "god created woman as an accessory to man", which not only annoyed me, it also cracked me up because it made me have a toy commercial flashback in my head where man was an action figure, and at the end of the commercial it would be like "woman sold seperately"
he also made sure to include "god intended marriage to be between a man and a woman" and then looked right at my mother and i (both gay) sitting in the front row. my mother hissed "just keep smiling" through her teeth at me as she smiled away. I love you, Chris. and i love you too, andrea.
by the way, that is a sultry ass pic in your profile | |
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cborgman said: my brother is a jw, and when he got married, the brother who officiated said "god created woman as an accessory to man", which not only annoyed me, it also cracked me up because it made me have a toy commercial flashback in my head where man was an action figure, and at the end of the commercial it would be like "woman sold seperately"
he also made sure to include "god intended marriage to be between a man and a woman" and then looked right at my mother and i (both gay) sitting in the front row. my mother hissed "just keep smiling" through her teeth at me as she smiled away. Off the top, what the WT Society says in their literature about women doesn't sound too bad. But some individual's interpretations of what the WTS says are frightening.And some of those individuals have great power over other people's lives.  Abuse is definitely tolerated in some JW congregations. Not usually outright physical abuse, but emotional abuse and degredation are common.The Brothers who are elders OFTEN put their own interpretation on what the Society or the Bible says.Men are from earth. Women are from earth. Deal with it. | |
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shellyevon said: cborgman said: my brother is a jw, and when he got married, the brother who officiated said "god created woman as an accessory to man", which not only annoyed me, it also cracked me up because it made me have a toy commercial flashback in my head where man was an action figure, and at the end of the commercial it would be like "woman sold seperately"
he also made sure to include "god intended marriage to be between a man and a woman" and then looked right at my mother and i (both gay) sitting in the front row. my mother hissed "just keep smiling" through her teeth at me as she smiled away. Off the top, what the WT Society says in their literature about women doesn't sound too bad. But some individual's interpretations of what the WTS says are frightening.And some of those individuals have great power over other people's lives. Abuse is definitely tolerated in some JW congregations. Not usually outright physical abuse, but emotional abuse and degredation are common.The Brothers who are elders OFTEN put their own interpretation on what the Society or the Bible says.what really bothered me about it was it was his daughter my brother married. | |
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cborgman said: applekisses said: I love you, Chris. and i love you too, andrea.
by the way, that is a sultry ass pic in your profile  Thanks!Measure in Love
"May the voice of the child in you never stop speaking. May it fall like a gift from heaven, offering to dessicated words its splendorous burst of laugher, the salt of its tears, its all powerful wildness." Maurice Blanchot | |
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Uhope said:[quote] mikek1 said: Here's how the Bible defines it: But I want you to know that the head of every man is the Christ; in turn the head of a woman is the man; in turn the head of the Christ is God. (1 Corinthians 11:3)
Animals aren't mentioned specifically here, but in Genesis, God gave the command to the man and the woman to care for the animals. Jehovah's Witnesses refer to this as "theocratic order" because the principle was laid out in God's inspired word rather than as a concept created by humans. heiress??  | |
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Uhope said: Jehovah's Witnesses refer to this as "theocratic order" because the principle was laid out in God's inspired word rather than as a concept created by humans.
Like there's a difference between the two.. "Shake yer reptile, baby!" | |
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