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Reply #30 posted 05/24/06 9:59pm

purplecam

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DorothyParkerWasCool said:

Although I loathe AI I cannot argue with a good business decision. It hurt me when Stevie did it earlier in the season and Prince's appearance has numbed me. But the game has changed so I have to adapt as well.

That's just it. It's a game and if you don't play the game, you're going to get played. I'm glad Prince played the game and as far as I'm concerned, he won. Simple as that.
I'm not a fan of "old Prince". I'm not a fan of "new Prince". I'm just a fan of Prince. Simple as that
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Reply #31 posted 05/24/06 10:00pm

jone70

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DenverMoon said:

American Idol? Is this not the man that is against record companies and how they handle artists??? The man who wrote "slave" on his face when he was the highest paid artist in history? the man who changed his name to a symbol so the record companies could not exploit his new works????

and he turns around and goes on the 1# show that makes kids sign up in these types contracts, contracts he's been fighting and warning people for over 15 years?

am I lost here? or did I miss something?????


I feel ya...I haven't worked out how I feel about the whole thing...but isn't AI a bit different than Prince's situation b/c the AI singers don't write & produce their own songs (for the most part), right? So if they aren't even the writers the issue about owning masters and contracts would be moot, no?
The check. The string he dropped. The Mona Lisa. The musical notes taken out of a hat. The glass. The toy shotgun painting. The things he found. Therefore, everything seen–every object, that is, plus the process of looking at it–is a Duchamp.
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Reply #32 posted 05/24/06 10:20pm

Moonbeam

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This was my lowest point as a Prince fan. I'm incredibly disappointed.
Feel free to join in the Prince Album Poll 2018! Let'a celebrate his legacy by counting down the most beloved Prince albums, as decided by you!
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Reply #33 posted 05/24/06 10:22pm

UncleGrandpa

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Well seeing that he's been so overwhelmingly successful on his own terms ( sarcasm alert), sooner or later he's going to tire of seeing his album sales go south of NPS, The Org/Quake/online fan community and the car trunk, he has to do something to justify painting his rental in those garish colors. It was not the greatest thing in the world but it was quick and painless, amounting to about 10,000 more CDs sold. I doubt it will affect the bottom line, thats what tours are for.
Jeux Sans Frontiers
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Reply #34 posted 05/24/06 10:24pm

CandaceS

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Anx said:

...And I also feel like he's completely separated himself from the anally principled artist who challenged everyone from the industry to his own fans about how they thought about life, politics, fame, the music biz, God, and all the other subjects he's touched upon.

The Prince who spat out that beautiful rant in the middle of "Sexuality" and the spitfire who gave us "The Rainbow Children" and the One Nite Alone tour is all Howard Hughes pre-OCD breakdown with his parties and his entourage of nubile women dancers and his facade of a lifestyle.


Spot on, Anx.
"I would say that Prince's top thirty percent is great. Of that thirty percent, I'll bet the public has heard twenty percent of it." - Susan Rogers, "Hunting for Prince's Vault", BBC, 2015
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Reply #35 posted 05/24/06 10:24pm

DMSR

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I don't hate the show, it's entertaining and it gets kids into old songs and older artists but....

Compare this Prince AI prime time performance with these:

1. Purple Rain at American Music Awards in 1985
2. Prince at the Grammys doing "Baby I'm a Star" in 1984
3. Prince on SNL doing "Electric Chair"

I could go on and on.. I know he's older and only had 5 minutes, but I always expect Prince to dazzle and surprise, and he just doesn't do that as much anymore.
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onedayimgonnabesomebody
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Reply #36 posted 05/24/06 10:28pm

realgirl2004

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I don't blame him. I wouldn't want my album to fail if I was him. If somebody said going on Maury or Jerry Springer would help album sales then Hell I would go. Even if He hates those shows I'm sure he would go if they were huge today like AI. So we all see this man does care about the success of 3121 biggrin
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Reply #37 posted 05/24/06 10:28pm

CandaceS

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thekidsgirl said:

... "It wasn't easy though," said one source, "because Prince apparently hates the show and has never even watched it." A rep for Prince didn't return calls.


In the March 2004 Entertainment Weekly cover story/interview, Prince was quoted talking about AI and William Hung in particular...he has definitely watched it and did not leave the impression he "hated" the show.
"I would say that Prince's top thirty percent is great. Of that thirty percent, I'll bet the public has heard twenty percent of it." - Susan Rogers, "Hunting for Prince's Vault", BBC, 2015
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Reply #38 posted 05/24/06 10:42pm

CandaceS

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UncleGrandpa said:

Well seeing that he's been so overwhelmingly successful on his own terms ( sarcasm alert), sooner or later he's going to tire of seeing his album sales go south of NPS, The Org/Quake/online fan community and the car trunk, he has to do something to justify painting his rental in those garish colors. It was not the greatest thing in the world but it was quick and painless, amounting to about 10,000 more CDs sold. I doubt it will affect the bottom line, thats what tours are for.



lol @ the first part! nod This might give 3121 a bit of a boost. Tours are good promo, but if the tour occurs many months after the release of the album you can't expect much of a bounce. I don't anticipate Confessions shooting back up the chart now that Madonna has started her tour, despite the massive publicity. twocents
"I would say that Prince's top thirty percent is great. Of that thirty percent, I'll bet the public has heard twenty percent of it." - Susan Rogers, "Hunting for Prince's Vault", BBC, 2015
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Reply #39 posted 05/24/06 11:16pm

ThreadBare

MUSIC LIFE JAPANESE MAGAZINE OCTOBER 1986



"See these cufflinks? Well, They cost money."

-- Prince, 1986
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Reply #40 posted 05/25/06 2:13am

wonder505

I think you guys have it all wrong. Just because Prince performed on a show does not mean he has to support the ideals of the show. Prince also performed at the Grammys and Brit Awards, even though he does not care too much for awards or may not support the selection process of other artists who signs contracts and don't own the song they would win the award for. Right? This was done for pure entertainment and I must say the way it went down was both a surprise and treat for his fans.

I don't see how he could be a sellout. This performance does not change the fact that Prince own masters of all recordings made post-WB or earns the majority of each sale. He is still going to do business the way he wants to do it and that is fine with me.
[Edited 5/25/06 2:18am]
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Reply #41 posted 05/25/06 2:19am

Snap

nah, he just keeps using the industry like they used to use him
i think it's kinda funny actually
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Reply #42 posted 05/25/06 2:22am

wonder505

Snap said:

nah, he just keeps using the industry like they used to use him
i think it's kinda funny actually


Hey, ain't nothing wrong with playing them with their own game while still owning your stuff.
[Edited 5/25/06 2:22am]
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Reply #43 posted 05/25/06 2:47am

calldapplwonde
ry83

Some of you just take this much too seriously. He has always done what he wanted and will always do what he wants. Seems like he really is less concerned about his reputation has a serious musician than his fans are. I really wasn't surprised by his appearance at all.
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Reply #44 posted 05/25/06 3:21am

CandaceS

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calldapplwondery83 said:

... Seems like he really is less concerned about his reputation has a serious musician than his fans are...


Two years ago, he was all about "real music by real musicians" and seemed to be promoting himself primarily as a serious and skilled musician, in particular contrasting himself to the "manufactured" stars dominating the charts. "Music before business" and all that. shrug
"I would say that Prince's top thirty percent is great. Of that thirty percent, I'll bet the public has heard twenty percent of it." - Susan Rogers, "Hunting for Prince's Vault", BBC, 2015
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Reply #45 posted 05/25/06 3:38am

andykeen

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Anx said:

I'm going to try not to go on a full on rant here, because I've been a pretty devoted fan for a long time, and because I have more fun enjoying Prince than I do when I'm criticizing him, and most importantly - it's late and I have to work early in the morning, and I shouldn't even be awake right now.

BUT.

I'm scratching my head over the whole AI thing right now. I didn't see it tonight, because I was out with some dear friends, and if I were home, I wouldn't have seen it anyway because I don't watch AI and I didn't hear the rumors about Prince's appearance.

Let me say that regardless of how I feel about his decision to be on AI, I am FIENDING to see a clip! I'm not gonna fake otherwise, because you all know me better than that. lol

I can't help but feel like David Byrne in that old Talking Heads song: This is not my beautiful Prince! This is not my beautiful badass!

Of course, another lyric to that song is "same as it ever was, same as it ever was..." lol

But I digress.

Las Vegas? American Idol? Big splashy celebrity parties?

Well, okay. Good for him, I guess. But I feel like Prince has decided to take on the role of schmaltzy megacelebrity while at the same time wanting the rebellious cred of a righteous artist fighting for what is due him.

And I also feel like he's completely separated himself from the anally principled artist who challenged everyone from the industry to his own fans about how they thought about life, politics, fame, the music biz, God, and all the other subjects he's touched upon.

The Prince who spat out that beautiful rant in the middle of "Sexuality" and the spitfire who gave us "The Rainbow Children" and the One Nite Alone tour is all Howard Hughes pre-OCD breakdown with his parties and his entourage of nubile women dancers and his facade of a lifestyle.

It's like 1992 all over again, only not as cool.

Prince is always going to be a bad MF when you put a guitar in his hands. I can never refute that. But I miss the man who could both kick my ass with his musicianship and leave me walking away trying to process what the hell he was talking about, whether I agreed with it or not.

Of course, in his own famously roundabout way, this could be exactly what he's doing right now.

"...same as it ever was...same as it ever was..."

Anyway. Bedtime. I'll read the slings and arrows in the morning. lol



Agree'd

Keenmeister
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Reply #46 posted 05/25/06 3:42am

calldapplwonde
ry83

That's right, but I don't think he stopped wanting to be seen as such. Maybe from his point of view a real musician can perform on such shows. And why not?
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Reply #47 posted 05/25/06 3:46am

PurpleCharm

calldapplwondery83 said:

Some of you just take this much too seriously. He has always done what he wanted and will always do what he wants. Seems like he really is less concerned about his reputation has a serious musician than his fans are. I really wasn't surprised by his appearance at all.


Exactly.

I was on the AI message board and there was a thread started questioning why Prince was chosen as the big surprise because they considered him a has been.. I was shocked at all the positive post in the thread. So many poster came to P's defense and set the poster straight by informing him/her that P was not only a legend but a multi-intstumentalist that produces, writes, arranges and plays all the instruments on his songs. biggrin
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Reply #48 posted 05/25/06 4:54am

herb4

American Idol? Is this not the man that is against record companies and how they handle artists??? The man who wrote "slave" on his face when he was the highest paid artist in history? the man who changed his name to a symbol so the record companies could not exploit his new works????


Here, here.

Well, okay. Good for him, I guess. But I feel like Prince has decided to take on the role of schmaltzy megacelebrity while at the same time wanting the rebellious cred of a righteous artist fighting for what is due him.


But he’s a walking contradiction so we should all like it.

The Beatles and the Stones were on the Ed Sullivan Show...which, including having some stellar rock performers, had some of the cheesiest vaudville-type acts on the face of the planet..lol ...American Idol is, in it's own way, becoming a modern-day version of the Ed Sullivan Show.


Apples and Oranges. Back then, there was no other outlet for musicians to be on TV. It was Ed or nothing basically.

That's just it. It's a game and if you don't play the game, you're going to get played. I'm glad Prince played the game and as far as I'm concerned, he won. Simple as that.


Uh huh. Except I seem to remember some songs...”Don’t Play Me”, “Jukebox With a Heartbeat”, ‘Slave to the System”....

This was my lowest point as a Prince fan. I'm incredibly disappointed.


No shit. I suffered through assless pants, the Lovesexy cover, the name change, Jehova, Graffitti Bridge and this thing makes me cringe more than any of it.

Two years ago, he was all about "real music by real musicians" and seemed to be promoting himself primarily as a serious and skilled musician, in particular contrasting himself to the "manufactured" stars dominating the charts. "Music before business" and all that.


Bingo. It’s a question of credibiility in my eyes. I loathe this show and everything it stands for and somehow feel like Prince is (or should be) above it. Can you picture Bob Dylan, Bruce Springsteen or Bono schmaltzing up their reps with a cheesy circus like this? MJ, yeah, but his rep is shot anyhow. To know that Prince was willingly breathing the same air as that prick Simon or a washed up hag like Paula Abdul makes my skin crawl.


This is a shark jumper, kids. Walking contradiction or not, Prince lost a lot of “coolness points” with me over this. American Idol is a sad fucking joke that niether speaks to nor rembodies ANY of the things that Prince has contributed to music over the last 30 odd years

It’s embarassing.
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Reply #49 posted 05/25/06 5:07am

shorttrini

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Here is my two cents.....What about him wanting to give back to upcoming artists ? . I mean yes, it was a great business move but, one can also look at it this way. By him appearing on the show, he is telling the other and future contestants "If you work hard, all this can be yours someday too". His appearance not only helped him but also helped AI. American Idol is just a vehicle to find new talent". Let's face it, very few of use are going to get discovered in the local library. In the music business it is not what u know, but who you know. AI is just making the entire process more centralized. The bad thing is, the people who are voting in my opinion really have no sense of what talent is and are only voting based on popularity. I say, get rid of Randy and Paula, keep Simon.Get two new judges and then let the games begin.

If you look at the British version of the show, talent is taken a lot more seriously and it is not that much of a popularity contest.
"Love is like peeing in your pants, everyone sees it but only you feel its warmth"
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Reply #50 posted 05/25/06 5:08am

calldapplwonde
ry83

herb4 said:



This is a shark jumper, kids. Walking contradiction or not, Prince lost a lot of “coolness points” with me over this.



Isn't the fact that he does whatever he wants "cool" as well? That he does not limit himself to anything? You know, if he says "oh no, I can't go on that show", he sets boundaries for himself, and personally I'm glad he doesn't. Seems like you can expect any and everything from him these days.
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Reply #51 posted 05/25/06 5:12am

JustErin

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He did it for publicity, I wouldn't read much more into it.
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Reply #52 posted 05/25/06 5:16am

COMPUTERBLUE19
84

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He did what any sensible artist/businessman would do to keep his name/product alive...HE PROMOTED IT!

The vehicle from where it was promoted seems to contradict his long standing rant about "Real music by real musicians" but lets face it, since his "comeback" in 2004, he's riding a wave of popularity.

I would rather him keep himself in the public eye via his music, versus turning into a carni-sideshow in which people speculate more about his personal life rather than his music.

He seems at peace doing these things, whether its the Grammy's with Beyonce, The RRHOF (Harrison Tribute), Soul Train, being a presenter at the OAscars, etc.)
"Old man's gotta be the old man. Fish has got to be the fish."
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Reply #53 posted 05/25/06 5:17am

shorttrini

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herb4 said:

American Idol? Is this not the man that is against record companies and how they handle artists??? The man who wrote "slave" on his face when he was the highest paid artist in history? the man who changed his name to a symbol so the record companies could not exploit his new works????


Here, here.



No shit. I suffered through assless pants, the Lovesexy cover, the name change, Jehova, Graffitti Bridge and this thing makes me cringe more than any of it.

Two years ago, he was all about "real music by real musicians" and seemed to be promoting himself primarily as a serious and skilled musician, in particular contrasting himself to the "manufactured" stars dominating the charts. "Music before business" and all that.


Bingo. It’s a question of credibiility in my eyes. I loathe this show and everything it stands for and somehow feel like Prince is (or should be) above it. Can you picture Bob Dylan, Bruce Springsteen or Bono schmaltzing up their reps with a cheesy circus like this? MJ, yeah, but his rep is shot anyhow. To know that Prince was willingly breathing the same air as that prick Simon or a washed up hag like Paula Abdul makes my skin crawl.


This is a shark jumper, kids. Walking contradiction or not, Prince lost a lot of “coolness points” with me over this. American Idol is a sad fucking joke that niether speaks to nor rembodies ANY of the things that Prince has contributed to music over the last 30 odd years

It’s embarassing.


I disagree with your comment about the Ed Sullivan show being the only show outlet. You also has American Bandstand and Hollaballoo. These were also on at the time. I also disagree with your comment Bono appearing on the show. I think he would. When u get to where they are, you have to "leave the ego" at the door. If you don't, your rep as an artist can get bruised.
"Love is like peeing in your pants, everyone sees it but only you feel its warmth"
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Reply #54 posted 05/25/06 5:30am

SHOCKADELICA1

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rolleyes Awww sellout, schmellout, blah, blah, blah blahblah(back 2 lurking mode lurking)
"Bring friends, bring your children and bring foot spray 'cause it's gon' be funky." ~ Prince

A kiss on the lips, is betta than a knife in the back ~ Sheila E

Darkness isn't the absence of light, it's the absence of U ~ Prince
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Reply #55 posted 05/25/06 5:31am

Anx

1. If anyone thinks I'm "surprised" or "shocked" by contradictory behavior by Prince, think again. Disappointed? Yes. Thinking he didn't have a choice in the matter? Kinda. Shocked? Hell no.

2. For everyone applauding the "smart business" of this appearance, can I get an explanation of the sterling marketing sense that went into doing ZERO promotion for 3121 just after it hit #1, and allowing the release of one track singles that no casual music buyer in their right mind could possibly want?

3. As far as Prince is concerned in my book, as an artist anyway, the only thing that matters anymore is the live performance...and even asset is starting to slip in the value of its spectacle. Fortunately, he has insane talent to fall back on. He'll always be amazing, but right now, I'm sorry, in my eyes the man's just uncool.

But the great thing about being a longtime Prince fan is, if I don't like him in the NOW, I have tons of audio and video and I can always revisit him in the THEN. music
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Reply #56 posted 05/25/06 5:32am

TurnItUp

DenverMoon said:

American Idol? Is this not the man that is against record companies and how they handle artists??? The man who wrote "slave" on his face when he was the highest paid artist in history? the man who changed his name to a symbol so the record companies could not exploit his new works????

and he turns around and goes on the 1# show that makes kids sign up in these types contracts, contracts he's been fighting and warning people for over 15 years?

am I lost here? or did I miss something?????


[Snip - luv4u] Sell out my ass, for 6 years from the mid 90's to early 00 Prince stayed out of the spotlight, true that he was still touring, but it wasn't getting him as far as when he finally got out here and started promoting himself starting when the Grammy's 2 years ago. He ain't no sell-out just because he went on AI. The one great thing that came out of this is he performed alone (not counting the twins) and not besides any of the contestants. I'm tellin' ya I'm glad Prince is got that attitude of doin' what he wanna do cuz somebody like you is always bitchin about somethin'!
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Reply #57 posted 05/25/06 5:34am

Isel

I already addressed this in another thread, but how is performing on a top-rated music show "selling-out"? He's performed on other music shows like American Bandstand, MTV award shows, the Grammy's, etc. in the past to promote himself, so how is performing on AI selling out? It's a venue that's available at this point in time. So what?

Hey a lot of other artists sell-out artistically by changing their music to pick-up the younger fans. Well, Prince didn't change his style of music: he just made his music more accessible to a younger audience by performing on A.I. because frankly, that show attracts the younger crowd. I don't see anything wrong with that.

At least Prince doesn't set-up himself as a social or political commentator to sell records: the guy just goes out there and entertains. And even if through his music he attempts to make some commentary or share his opinions, Prince doesn't need visual concepts to express himself--to get his message across. Prince's message, when he chooses to share, is all about his music, period.

Maybe at this point in his career, he is lightening up a bit about himself. Then again, maybe he was "teaching" the American Idols, the judges, and the viewers a little somethin' somethin', too. Yeah, Taylor Hicks won the contract, but Prince stole the show. There is no one like Prince, and ironically I'm not sure if his style of music would "win" American Idol. But Prince just reminded new generation exactly how he became a legend.
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Reply #58 posted 05/25/06 5:36am

TurnItUp

rainbowchild said:

I thought it was a great move on Prince's part; he should have appeared weeks ago. It gave him exposure to millions of viewers-- especially younger viewers-- who's not familiar with him and be blown away!!!!!


No, I thought it was a great move that he waited until the season finale and near the end of the show. Another thing he didn't give any signals that that record companies are loyal or nothing to the newcomers. He simply did what he wanted and that is come on the show for his own personal gain and he walked off the stage, he didn't even acknowledge Ryan Seacrest. Leave him alone.
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Reply #59 posted 05/25/06 5:38am

TurnItUp

DMSR said:

I don't hate the show, it's entertaining and it gets kids into old songs and older artists but....

Compare this Prince AI prime time performance with these:

1. Purple Rain at American Music Awards in 1985
2. Prince at the Grammys doing "Baby I'm a Star" in 1984
3. Prince on SNL doing "Electric Chair"

I could go on and on.. I know he's older and only had 5 minutes, but I always expect Prince to dazzle and surprise, and he just doesn't do that as much anymore.


Yes he does. He did it last night and definitely for me. Maybe he just doesn't do it for you.
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